Is it time for new HW to match the qaulity of the SW?

pgregg88 · Post by **pgregg88** » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:33 am

Friends,

The advancements made in this community are nothing short of amazing. To add to the fun, I'm considering designing and manufacturing a new transmitter/controller to match the level of software and hardware (main board replacements) being built or contemplated here.

Is this of interest? I suspect most everyone would appreciate a higher quality feel (and quieter buttons), but is this really necessary? You tell me.

Cost is going to be a real challenge. We all know a great feature of the 9x is the cost. I don't know how they make any profit manufacturing these.

I'd really like to hear your thoughts.

- What would you improve (outside of the scope Gruvin's board and the ersky9x project)?

- What bugs you the most about your 9x? Please rate on a scale of 1 to 5 (1 = minor announce I can live with, 5 = I'd be OK adding $50 USD to the price if this specific item was dramatically better)

- What do you like about other transmitters you've owned that isn't up to par on the 9x?

- What do you like about the 9x box you absolutely want to keep?

- Are we better off just waiting for the next unit out of Fly-Sky or finding another off-the-shelf unit?
The FS-T6? http://www.flysky-cn.com/eShowProducts.asp?id=51

- Am I crazy to be contemplating this?

I look forward to hearing from you.

Preston

Post by **cre8tiveleo** » Tue Feb 21, 2012 12:01 pm

By all means do one up, there has been a lot of talk within the group already on this. There are others already desinging cases, I am designing one as well. It's more for the love of doing it, selling a modified case would not be the best. I for one wouldn't buy a new case, unless it was super cheap and would blow the old case away. It's just not worth it for a $40 radio. It's functional as it is. Even with the upcoming ersky board, you can still add switches to the current case without issue.
Designing a case is rather specific, I'd wait for the new board to come out and see what it requires or can handle, then go from there.

Post by **Kilrah** » Tue Feb 21, 2012 1:09 pm

cre8tiveleo wrote:It's just not worth it for a $40 radio. It's functional as it is. Even with the upcoming ersky board, you can still add switches to the current case without issue.

Yeah, I think his point is rather "now we have a great SW, why not ditch all the HW (cheap gimbals and switches, plasticky case) and make something better". I quite agree, ER9X turns a decent but limited $40 radio (it's actually become more of a $60 radio now) into a very good $100 radio (add FrSky telemetry and components required for flashing/interfacing). But as the SW is good to the point where it can nearly match top of line commercial radios out of the box, will be even more so once the ersky board is there, and being open source can become way better as it can be upgraded to do that one little thing nobody else does or does poorly, it deserves more than being constrained to a $40 radio and could be worth putting in higher quality HW. I for one would be glad to pay $300-500 for a radio based on ersky with a high quality case and switches, gimbals on ball bearings, side pots à la Futaba 8FG and up, all connectors neatly placed, accessible microSD card, a screen window adapted to a nice big color touchscreen etc.

A fully community-designed higher end radio in essence.

cre8tiveleo wrote:Designing a case is rather specific, I'd wait for the new board to come out and see what it requires or can handle, then go from there.

Yep, let's do it that way

JX3P · Post by **JX3P** » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:04 pm

something like this?

B12 · Post by **B12** » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:46 pm

Designing a new PCB and buying high spec switches is no big deal but making a new case for sale is a business suicide. The injection molds cost a fortune even if you order one from China. Making a case of sheetmetal, plywood or cardboard etc can be cost effective but how many people like the looks enough to buy one.

The software has potential for sure for use with some higher level radio. Maybe the best option might be to try to co-operate with FrSky or somebody. They would make the hardware and somebody the software. But they being from one asian country, they might just as well download the er9x and use it as a base for their supposed to be released in the future radio without asking anybody.

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:56 pm

I don't know but I have a feeling that you might be right..

I think that will happen

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:58 pm

Nice radio.. but I wouldn't have it even if I had the money to buy it.. I fly with my thumbs..

Flaps 30 · Post by **Flaps 30** » Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:32 pm

The TX 26 isn't something I would go for, as I operate with thumbs and I do prefer the 'twisted' joysticks as used on some multiplex transmitters. The idea of having what looks like a flimsy LCD display is asking for it to get knocked off. More sliders are needed, and seeing that no one actually can fly and look at whatever display they have, maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to have it on a motorised sled that pops out as and when it is needed for adjustment purposes.

Seeing that I have small hands and not the giant slabs of meat that a lot of men have. Could I ask for the joysticks and switches to be close to the sides. As an afterthought. It would be great if a makeup mirror with a storage area for lipstick to be available in/on the case.

As much as I like the idea of a new case with good quality hardware. Somehow I feel that the market would be too small and the needs of the users so varied that you couldn't come up with one that would be commercially viable.

JX3P · Post by **JX3P** » Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:05 am

another concept from Joshua Mojzes

DHDSP · Post by **DHDSP** » Fri May 11, 2012 10:31 am

After playing around with mods and software, I have the same feeling as the original poster: the hardware quality does surely not match the software.
I love the look of the new Jeti DS-16 posted above - the display mounted above the sticks is what I want for my next transmitter. I'm looking into possibilities to copy the design, and do it cost-efective.

Just for fun (and without real sizes and number of holes) I calculated an aluminum front panel (which could then be color galvanised) including the milling, and that seems doable (like in 30€ or so). It's just that I'm not really good with mechanics... I saw a solution having an "open" case, like open to the sides , like a sandwich. That didn't look too bad.

Is there a case construction project for ersky9x anywhere?

CU
Peter

SkyNorth · Post by **SkyNorth** » Fri May 11, 2012 11:10 am

We have toyed with the idea , of a new case ...I feel a lot of users want a plastic molded case , they look at the simple metal
case as primitive.

The ersky board , can support a second LCD panel on the I2C connector. I'm working on a small adapter pcb for it.
The display is 100 x 160 x 16 grey scales . about 2" x 2"
-Brent

Post by **cre8tiveleo** » Fri May 11, 2012 11:59 am

Brent is...

When it comes to hw design!

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I am here: http://tapatalk.com/map.php?qwuec0

Crashj007 · Post by **Crashj007** » Fri May 11, 2012 12:55 pm

Got my new transmitter from R2hobbies yesterday and it started me thinking about this design issue. Europeans seem to like tray systems, others like the usual box necklace style.
I have figured out the trims should be on the back side of the case. Too many variables to invest in tooling.
http://www.3dprototype.com/
can provide a case for a couple hundred bucks, of course.

Post by **cre8tiveleo** » Fri May 11, 2012 1:48 pm

I'm implanting mine , no box, no worries. It'll be the trend next year.

Post by **Rob Thomson** » Fri May 11, 2012 2:02 pm

I am up for getting a prototype done - but have no design skills

Anyone interested in this as a 'sub project' ?

Rob

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Post by **cre8tiveleo** » Fri May 11, 2012 2:20 pm

I've been doodling in Solid works for a bit, might post up what i've done so far... But it's top secret...

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I am here: http://tapatalk.com/map.php?iwq0pl

DHDSP · Post by **DHDSP** » Fri May 11, 2012 4:08 pm

SkyNorth wrote:We have toyed with the idea , of a new case ...I feel a lot of users want a plastic molded case , they look at the simple metal
case as primitive.

Probably right, but I still don't think the Jeti DS-16 looks cheap - and it looks like it has a metal case. That's why I thought about the elox(color galvanising?).
Molding, right. I thought about that, making a mould and a carbonfibre case. But I'm not sure about how difficult the holes would be. So I thought that milling a plane surface would be more cost effective, and could be reproduced everywhere by taking a file to someone with a cnc milling machine. You could even use carbon prepegs...

SkyNorth wrote:The ersky board , can support a second LCD panel on the I2C connector. I'm working on a small adapter pcb for it.
The display is 100 x 160 x 16 grey scales . about 2" x 2"
-Brent

That would be great - but bigger and "touchier" would even be greater

CU
Peter

DHDSP · Post by **DHDSP** » Fri May 11, 2012 4:58 pm

Crashj007 wrote:Europeans seem to like tray systems, others like the usual box necklace style.
I have figured out the trims should be on the back side of the case. Too many variables to invest in tooling.

Yes, wo do have many people flying tray systems over here. But that could be overcome by having detachable (slide-in) sides - much better than an extra tray. And only one case has to be designed, not two.

Hardsuit · Post by **Hardsuit** » Tue May 15, 2012 1:06 am

You could always design something that was intended to be printed out at a 3D printing place like Shapeways, assuming one of the materials that is available is suitable for use and strong enough. (And also doesn't cost an arm and a leg...)

DHDSP · Post by **DHDSP** » Wed May 16, 2012 5:40 am

The finish of the 3d prints seems very coarse. Has anyone actually had something printed there ?

Crashj007 · Post by **Crashj007** » Wed May 16, 2012 3:15 pm

DHDSP wrote:
Crashj007 wrote:Europeans seem to like tray systems,<>
Yes, wo do have many people flying tray systems over here. But that could be overcome by having detachable (slide-in) sides - much better than an extra tray. And only one case has to be designed, not two.

I like the idea of a slide on piece that become the equivalent to a tray. Sort of like a cigarette girl carries, eh?

olafnew · Post by **olafnew** » Thu May 31, 2012 3:05 pm

Like the idea of a new case for the system. Given in mind, that after having an excellent alternative, such as an ersky board - the overall look and feel of the original case - is simply not good enough.

Btw - i've had an attempt to try and fit in the Aurora 9 sticks(gimbals), available from lynxmotion - unfortunately - it's not a direct replacement. Mechanically they do not fit, and, electronically - they are not 100% replacement, as they have a 270 degree pots, instead of 90 degree pots of the turnigy original gimbals. Given the idea, that someone was willing to alter the FW of the ersky board, for these gimbals to be compatible - it is really a necceccity to see an alternative case for the RC unit. It is also a great comparison - the gimbals from 9x and the Aurora9 gimbals.. It's like comparing a cheap famie with a carbon fiber plane. The quality of the feel and look of the Aurora9 gimbals is simply astonishing, and that is even worse, in spite of the fact that they do not fit..

On my end - i'll try to design an adapter that will allow fitting the Aurora 9 gimbals into the turnigy(i'll open source it), but still - it would be absolutely great to see the design of a new case, the one, that can fully incorporate the second LCD screen of the ersky board, and the one - that would have an ability to have different gimbals fitted(presumably with adapter plates?) Anyone up for the task? In terms of commerce - this is, of course, a suicide. And the only option, apart from 3d printing, is having a CNC mill milling the case from a single block, yep - it will cost a fortune - but if the drawing are open sourced - why not? And everyone will be able to choose how to make one.

Crashj007 · Post by **Crashj007** » Thu May 31, 2012 8:52 pm

Here is a possibility:
http://www.shapeways.com/
I could do the CAD work in Solidworks, but I do not have any inspirations on the design layout since there are so many variables.
If anyone has the CAD models of the gimbals that would be a good start.

iwik · Post by **iwik** » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:30 pm

Hi Guys,
Ive had Shpaeways 3d printing done. Yes it can be course although depending on the price paid, one can have the surface polished. It helps but its not
smooth like injection molded. The effect you get is more a textured one. If one wants a really smooth finish then there are 3d printers that will do it
but cost is very high. Ive heard that once these Shapeways have had afew coats of paint they can be much smoother looking.
Les

DHDSP · Post by **DHDSP** » Sat Jun 02, 2012 6:46 pm

Basically, I think Olaf is right. I'm not sure about the 3D-milling though.
That's why I am looking into 2D-milling, there are a lot of companies offering 2D front plate milling, and it's definetely less cost intensive.
The design I really like is that of the Jeti DS16 or DC16. Both of them don't need 3D-milling - just 2D-milled front plates. I'm still looking for a solution to make a box out of it (the aluminum sides would be much more difficult (and expensive) to mill...

olafnew · Post by **olafnew** » Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:10 pm

Crashj007 wrote:Here is a possibility:

Resieved your PM, but unfortunately - i'm unable to answer - the forum doesent allow replying or making a new M message, until, i quote "you must participate more", probably some forum settings. But, nevertheless - i'm back from my business trip - today i'll sit and sketch an appropriate adapter plate, to suit the current case with those replacement gimbals.

Crashj007 · Post by **Crashj007** » Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:38 pm

If you could be happy with a milled/etched,whatever front and back panel, this may help:
http://www.pactecenclosures.com/product ... classid=26
or for larger check out the PT-10.
There are 3D files on the site and I have the PT-8 done as a Solidworks assembly file and can send that or a converted file.

olafnew · Post by **olafnew** » Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:35 pm

A little update:
designed an adapter, just today received my 3d prints from a local 3d printer supplier. Will try to install the Aurora9 gimbals mechanically, and if everything will fit snugly, will redesign the small PCB which is responsible for trim buttons and interconnections between the stock gimbals and the main-board. After everything will fit nicely - all the drawings will be available to the community.

P.S. If i'll be able to beat my laziness - the next thing will be designing the whole new case. 100% i'll drop the compatibility with stock gimbals, trim buttons, stock LCD and stock board )). Aurora 9 gimbals, separate trim buttons PCB(new buttons, and everything on connectors, without soldered wires), ersky9 PCB, and replacement LCD.

Post by **Rob Thomson** » Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:42 pm

Sounds like a good idea!

Fromi · Post by **Fromi** » Tue Jul 10, 2012 3:34 pm

Why not rebuild old ones like this:

I dont think you will get all you have on this for 30 usd

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